A Spirit of Confusion

If all you possessed was a Bible and an unlimited amount of time, you would never be able to understand what this means.

If all you possessed was a Bible and an unlimited amount of time, you would never be able to understand what this direct reply means.

I had previously reported on the growing division in the Roman Catholic in “The Diocese of Egypt” on December 19, 2023. The current Pope’s teachings on homosexuality, the death penalty, and other teachings have drawn much criticism from the Catholic faithful. One of those is Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano, who is now facing a possible excommunication. In response, he has now accused the sitting Pope of heresy and schism. You can read his statement here.

Dr. Jules Gomes, Will Schneider Suffer Viganò’s Fate for Opposing Vatican II?

I had discussed the issue of the ecumenical councils as recently as May 6, 2024 in “The Living Voice.”

At issue in the debate is whether or not Vatican II is an ecumenical council, and thus whether or not its teachings must be accepted. The problem lies in the fact that Roman Catholicism has never infallibly defined a list of ecumenical councils (nor a list of infallibly defined ex cathedra statements, nor a list of infallibly defined dogmatic truths), forcing the Catholic faithful—including Vigano—to make private, personal determinations of what the church has infallibly declared must be believed, that is, to privately determine the very essence of what it means to be Roman Catholic.

Roman Catholics are not allowed to make private, personal determinations of what to believe, because that would make them no better than Protestants. But that’s how the situation is: a mess of confusion that leaves Roman Catholics no better off than their despised counterparts.

Roman Catholic Timothy Gordon helps explain the issue in his broadcast here from 16:30 to 19:48. Here is a partial transcript:

“Authority has never been worked out in the Roman Catholic Church to the extent that we insinuate it has when we thumb our noses at Protestants and say ‘You guys have no conception of authority.’ They don’t. But we flatly don’t even know with certitude how many times Pastor Aeternus [Vatican I document on Papal Infallibility] ex cathedra announcements to the whole world, dogmatization ex nihilo by the Pope, has been exercised. Some say its only two. Some say it’s five or six. Some say its like seven or eight. That means we too, at a much finer grain, have an issue with authority.

But also we have that metamagisterial issue where we also point at the Protestants and we say ‘You have no authority and you also have no magisterial authority,’ meaning anyone can read the Bible and say it means anything he wants. Yeah, but we also don’t have a metamagisterial statement on that kind of authority either. Because we don’t know outside of Denzigner, Ott, Newman, anything other than theories as to what levels of authority there are. Well there’s ex cathedra, but there’s also religious submission. People are just abstracting. The issue of authority is the biggest embarrassment to Roman Catholics. And it’s not just a new thing. … it is a real, bi-millennial discontinuity. … Doctrinally, this is our biggest fly in the ointment. … Magisterial authority: It’s not perfectly clear.”

According to Gomes, the auxiliary bishop of Kazakhstan, Athanasius Schneider, may soon join Vigano in his fate for daring to declare beliefs that have not been clearly and infallibly declared.

Stay tuned.

12 Comments

  1. Lastmod

    Being raised culturally “preppy catholic” (Episcopalian / American branch of the Church of England post 1781)

    I find all of this confusing as well.

    Attending an actual “high” Anglican Service in Manchester in June 2022 (out of respect for my late mother who in her later years became a very devout / reconnected Anglican). I will say I found it beautiful. Something so rooted in the culture or DNA of a people.

    Did I hear the word Jesus uttered? I think once. The recital of the Lords Prayer? Yes. I am familiar with the Common Book of Prayer so I knew when to stand. To sit. To kneel.

    I was not permitted to take Holy Communion (and I should not have been, I am not Anglican) but I did kneel and have the Vicar pray over me and “bless and keep thee”

    The cultural rituals in itself was touching. I mentioned before at Jack’s and maybe here…….that I could feel my heritage or some “commonality” because my ancestors in Britain had been attending this since the COE was founded by Henry VII centuries ago. I could almost see long gone forgotten ancestors performing the same rituals. There is a power or “sense of belonging” in this. I will admit.

    From the procession of the Cropss. To the coutsey of women to the altar before entering the pew. To the me with a slight half kneel before doing the same. To the call to prayer. The choral recital.

    It was indeed beautiful. Also inside a church that survived the blitz, the countless wars, and kings, and vicars, and nameless, faceless people over the centuries who prayed, cried, gained hope, faced fear, were wed, and who died. Powerful.

    The music? Lets say these High Churches have us American Protestants beat on all levels. An actual REAL church pipe organ and REAL hymns of victory, lifted from scripture. I could almost feel tears welling up in my eyes as I sang “Love Divine” and other classic, beautiful hymns. Timeless.

    And…come back to the USA, any protestant church we have a “rock band” and horrible praise music and we have to do this “or the young people wont come” and you look around, and there aint any young people there 🙂

  2. professorGBFMtm

    And…come back to the USA, any protestant church we have a “rock band” and horrible praise music and we have to do this “or the young people wont come” and you look around, and there aint any young people there 🙂

    It ain’t that much different in the sphere though ”if I don’t say ”Redpill” the cool and nerdy kids who thought the Matrix was cool and off the hook, 25 to twenty-three years ago won’t understand like my genius @ss that the sphere isn’t supposed to be a MAN-h8ting place even though it is”

    Behind the times,out-of-touch is to say the least about the ”leaders” out here, just look at ”jack’s” latest ”I’am your ”redpill” pope f@ols-who are NOT as ”Genius” as my unverified by the ”redpill” board of the bored and boring,140 I.Q. self!!!”

    1. Lastmod

      Ive read the Bible twice in its entirety. Now, can I remember every situation, verse, and recall every part of this book that contains a ton of violence, backbiting, trickery, sin, anger, vengeance, murder, and sex?

      No.

      But I can tell you it doesnt say:

      *Youth Pastor / ministry
      *Bishop, Deacon, Elder, Board Member, Praise Leader, Usher, Womens Ministry, Mens Ministry, building minsitry, youth camp…..
      *Nor does it say Pope
      *Nor does it say anywhere liturgical texts, growing a beard, wearing robes, praying to Mary or praying to “the saints”
      *Jesus gave no instructions on what a “church” was supposed to look like but God did give instructions on what the Temple should look like and dimensions thereof (Jesus said nothing about this. Why? You didnt have to have one to love and worship God ;-))
      *It says nowhere that a “priest” has to conduct “the lords supper”
      *It says nowhere about lighting candles before statues, painted pieces of wood or “feasts” in this or that saints “holy name”
      *It says nothing about a Board of Directors
      *It says nothing about a priests / pastors pay / salary / retirement or housing.
      *It says nothing about “seminary” or “bible college” in order to preach said Word of God
      *It says nothing about men must go to a gym or learn Game or learn to be Casanovas in order to “take a wife”

      Want more??? 😉

  3. Lastmod

    Off topic, but a half decent explanation of why men who are trying to date. Men who are married and men in general are having a hard time in this new dynamic.

    https://www.youtube.com/shorts/foTgtVs9Pm0

    I am sure Red Pill / Frame / Game answers will be textbook and simple.

    *Ban women and girls from using a cellphone.
    *Monitor all her accounts daily.
    *Threaten and “beat up” any man who comments on any picture your wife / gf / daughter posts on social media
    *ban all dating sites and apps
    *Tell your wife or GF is she doesnt obey you, you can get one who does easily
    *Tell her you will divorce her and she will get nothing (try that in a real court)

    1. professorGBFMtm

      ”*Tell your wife or GF is she doesnt obey you, you can get one who does easily
      *Tell her you will divorce her and she will get nothing (try that in a real court)”

      The Detian solution to that is to hide out in Nowheresville Europe(it NEVER will be as long as a lot of money is involved-which he oddly NEVER mentions) until the heat is off to his credit😉

  4. professorGBFMtm

    ”*It says nothing about men must go to a gym or learn Game or learn to be Casanovas in order to “take a wife””

    Yeah, the so-called ”headship” ”authoritarian” ”Fathers” of daughters in the sphere always keep mum on the fact it’s the parents’ responsibility to get their children married NOT the children’s!

    They despise their own children and are without excuse as they claim ”special knowledge” like Jack-who has claimed God has spoken extra-biblical ”messages” directly to him! And they should have GREAT fear because of it-WHY?

    Namely things like these:

    ” See that you do not despise one of these little ones. For I tell you that in heaven their angels always see the face of my Father who is in heaven. – Matthew 18:10”

    &

    ”Behold, the third time I am ready to come to you; and I will not be burdensome to you: for I seek not your’s, but you: for the children ought not to lay up for the parents, but the parents for the children.-2 Corinthians 12:14”’

    As well as when they judge ”churchians” and ”bluepillers”.

    ”1 “Do not judge, or you too will be judged.
    2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.
    3 “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?-Matthew 7:3”

    They will be judged harsher than churchians and bluepillers as they are supposedly ”holier” than them.

    1. Lastmod

      If any of their daughters were married…..came home to cry / ask for help with her impossible husband….every one of those men who cleaim “Headship” the loudest and “Authority” in marriage would roll up and “have a chat with the husband” with a veiled threat of “my daughter is my princess / she will always be my little girl / make her happy or things could get serious”

      Notta a one of them would say “He’s your husband, pray for him, call him Lord like Sarah and you are under his authority now. If you let him be a man, you will naturally want to submit” and go back to reading the paper, watching the TV or retiring to the garage to work on his vintage muscle car (which every man now seems to own)

  5. professorGBFMtm

    ”Notta a one of them would say “He’s your husband, pray for him, call him Lord like Sarah and you are under his authority now. If you let him be a man, you will naturally want to submit” and go back to reading the paper, watching the TV or retiring to the garage to work on his vintage muscle car (which every man now seems to own)”

    YEP! BUT ”Jack” is still fascinated by Derek’s marriage ”model” as shown below.

    Hey MOD,” Jack” has had a vision mainly thanks to our friend Derek here.

    ”Jack says:
    2024-07-05 at 3:42 am
    DS,

    “I just call it what it is usually which is headship-submission and love-respect.”

    Good point. The difference between Headship and my concept of Peaceful Unity is that Headship emphasizes the structure of authority, whereas Peaceful Unity stresses the ‘one flesh’ / pair bonding / unity and especially the blessing of God’s felt presence in the union. We might also use Headship to describe the relationship between spiritually immature couples who strive to follow the Biblical Order, and Peaceful Unity for those who are more advanced in age or maturity. Also, Headship is necessary for Peaceful Unity. While Headship is rare, Peaceful Unity is much rarer.

    “So you think he has a peaceful unity model even if it does not line up theologically / exegetically?

    Or you think he believes he has some sort of Peaceful Unity model that is similar in function?”

    My view is exactly what you wrote next, with emphasis.

    “I think we agree that most very attractive men who marry a woman who is all-in for them and men who either luck into or select a woman to marry that naturally has a follower, humble, and submissive personality will have a Peaceful Unity marriage in function at least.

    However, they may not necessarily have the same theological and/or exegetical framework on the Biblical Scriptures. In fact, you tend to see that many of these men default more toward chivalrous and even egalitarian framework because they don’t realize they are the exception. It’s often also why they have trouble articulating it and giving advice to men that don’t have it because they do not have women/wives that are more inclined to rebellion.”

    That’s right. That’s how I see it too. That’s the bizarre paradox of a man having a very spiritually mature wife — too much “Peaceful Unity” tends to Blue Pill the husband into the la la land of love. But perhaps this is an appropriate context for certain Blue Pill idealizations of a much-loved wife, simply because ideal wives such as this deserve to be loved. (I don’t mean to say this is good or right, but it is appropriate — another strange irony.)

    That’s how I see Derek. He and his wife are too close to see each other clearly. I say this to his honor, but as you described above, it doesn’t help his exegesis of scripture.

    Of course, this is all conjecture and best guesstimation, because we cannot observe Derek’s marriage first-hand. Derek has written tomes on his views of marriage but he is rather tight-lipped when it comes to talking about his own marriage. But from what I can tell, I believe Derek has a marriage that fits my description of the Peaceful Unity model (not to be confused with his own descriptions of marriage); that is, he has an agentic, spiritually mature, obedient, submissive wife, which frees him up to write a compendium of apologetics on his concept of “mutual submission” (which many of us here believe is errant, as Thedeti satirized above).

    Casual readers should note that Derek’s descriptions of marriage are not at all like my descriptions of the Peaceful Unity model or our other writings on Headship. I kindly ask that readers not confuse the two.

    That said, I’m going to keep beating the drum about Peaceful Unity, because I had a vision about this, and I truly believe this is God’s ideal for marriage. This is what is missing in too many marriages — the constant presence of God.”

    IOW?” Jack” wants Derek, me, and you MOD back under his ”moderating”(”red pill” for censoring unpopular viewpoints) and ”clarity editing” thumb at SF.

    1. Lastmod

      How can you have a constant presence of God in a marriage when God did not make woman in his image? (according to many of them). How can you have that when you have to resort to peeing in the bed? How can you have that presence when the only thing is SUBMIT. OBEY. SEX.

      Even Jesus wanted their own free will from the teacher of the law to come to him. That is how you can have a genuine presence. I dont see how all of this works.

  6. professorGBFMtm

    MOD here’s some more from supposed ”leaders”, ”geniuses”, and ”saints”.

    ”Critical Navigating
    In response to The Mechanics of Sectarianism within The Christian Red Pill (2024/7/3), Saint Thedeti said,

    “I don’t find discussions or topics like these to be helpful or productive like DAL’S legendary ”butthexting done right bros” live Q&A sessions from Texas” was for I and numerous other butthexing loving dudes.

    In my view, the only pertinent inquiries are…

    “Is the matter asserted true or false in light of all available evidence and circumstances, including scripture, tradition, experience, and reason?”

    “Is the matter or proposition beneficial or detrimental to a man, to men, to his family, or to society, in light of scripture, tradition, experience, and reason?”

    God gave us love, power, and sound minds. We’re invited to gather together as men and “reason together”. He did not ask us to leave reason and experience at the door when He called us to Him.”

    The questions posed by Thedeti are what each man should be asking himself whenever consuming content. Here we’re referring specifically to Red Pill stuff, but it goes for anything really; listening to a sermon, reading the news, watching YouTube, and so on. A man should always be filtering the information that he takes in, sorting out what is good / relevant / true / useful, and what is not.

    But as NovaSeeker and I described in the previous post, when men begin to discuss these topics amongst themselves, there is often a phenomenological misunderstanding which prevents meaningful communication.

    Moving Off the Gridlock butthext Charts
    For an example of what I mean, LastHoldOut summed up the basics in this comment from an earlier discussion of this topic.

    “The rhetorical and practical question / thread in all these discussions is, “Where is the “church” (small caps church) in all of this?” Church “leaders” have allowed the entire landscape to be re-framed. It is time to come down hard within our own Christian community — to get our own house in order. We can’t correct anything if we cannot correct ourselves.

    Until we slap the Christian “leaders” (pastors, authors, and counselors) out of the post-modern feminist Blue Pill world, we’re p!ss!ng up a rope. We’re wandering in the wilderness alone (Option 3) with our hineys getting nary an All-important IOI from the sk@nkz. There needs to be a rhetoric that focuses on those pastors, authors, and counselors who have sold Christian marriage (i.e., the marriage foundations) down the river as much as ”redpillers have also.

    There are very basic foundations that have been papered over in the last 50 years of butthextual paradise:

    The man holds headship in the marriage;
    The wife is to submit to her husband in “everything;”
    The couple are to become one, which, according to Paul, happens only through the act of sex between the two. (See 1st Corinthians 6:16); and…
    The practice of bilateral repentance / forgiveness must be a dynamic that is practiced by husband and wife.
    These four are the TRUE Christian belief(ye are NOT a real=True Christian if ye believe it NOT like Ripley yo!): Christ : Church :: Husband : Wife parallel:

    The Christ : Church :: Husband : Wife Parallel
    The Headship of Christ. –> The headship of the husband.
    The Church submits to Christ. –> The wife submits to the husband.
    “For you are all one in Christ Jesus” (Galatians 3:28). –> “The two shall become one flesh” (Matthew 19:5).
    The repentance-forgiveness dynamic between believers (the Church) and Christ. –> The bi-lateral repentance-forgiveness dynamic between two spouses.
    Like many of you, I’ve not heard these preached as foundations for marriage in the last 50 years.

    Pastors, authors, and counselors have placed a disproportionate focus on Ephesians 5:25-39 and thus re-framed the marriage.

    If we cannot correct our own, how are we to be the salt?”

    I’ll briefly sum up some other central tenets that have come to light:

    Men need to find their calling / mission / purpose / work/ butthexer in good standing in the ”red pill” community and focus on developing that. (News Flash: Marriage is NOT a calling / mission.)
    Men need to identify their domain of authority and work within their sphere of influence. This means, No More Mr. Nice Guy™ going around squandering his essence by handing out altruistic freebies.
    Single men interested in marriage need to select their pool of eligibles wisely (or change pools) and learn how to detect IOIs from young single gals who eye their rear for butthexing yo word to the hos and brothers let them get an eyeful of your hiney after a good day of weight handling in the gym.
    Men who can detect the IOIs being thrown at them, but who are not attracted to those women who are giving out the IOIs, have to either (1) accept their lot, play tons of vid games I mean the good ole days of vid games i.e. retro like my failing ”red pill Dalrockian” stick that the kids h8 and the married/divorced as well as non-married/divorced guys get bored by and leave sf because of ; or (2) level up somehow perhaps thanx to ”headship swinger gay porn” as I, ”Christian”mike Davis and ”Sparkly” had hoped in September 2021 from
    ”Lessons on Life and Marriage from Matthew 10: plus lots of gay butthexting empowerment thanx to ”jack”!”?
    Readers are invited to add others. ”

    1. Lastmod

      What marriage is not a calling / mission?

      Every one of those men for years said to me “I knew I wanted to be married and I had to make myself ready for that” (going to the gym, learning Game, career, asking women out cause-they-dont-bite)

      So being married and a father is no longer a calling or mission or a God thing. It just happens.

  7. professorGBFMtm

    ”What marriage is not a calling / mission?”

    Yeah, so-called ”civilizationist” ”Jack’s” seething h8 for mission-minded marriage began around this time.

    ”Why you will marry the wrong person or why marriage sux or even why marriage is NOT for” redpill” mission minded npcs

    Posted on 2022-03-02 by Jack
    Thoughts from Alain de Bo(u?)tton about the nature of love.

    Readership: All
    Theme: Risk Assessment
    Length: 1,500 words
    Reading Time: 5 minutes + 22:19 minute video (Alternately, the transcript requires 20 minutes of reading time.)

    Introduction
    This is the first post under the theme for March: Risk Assessment. Here, we cover a speech given by Alain de Bo(u?)tton that succinctly summarizes the basic ontology of platonic yet
    erotic butt love, as well as the challenges and hurdles of long term relationships from a ”redpill” and non-scriptual mystical perspective. It is quite pertinent to the Red Pill wisdom we canvas here on Σ Frame.

    This video was recommended to me through email by not just one, but two readers!

    One reader wrote,

    “I’m quite impressed with a particular philosopher who gets a lot of human psychology right: Alain de Botton. I’m sure anyone could find things we’d not agree with (as usual), but this one video captures and articulates so much of what my heart-led wisdom has taught me that it’s hard not to share it.”

    I too don’t fully agree with all the nuances of de Bo(u?)tton’s perspectives, but on the whole, his insights reflect many epiphanies I’ve discovered in the past in my own rear with various IOIS.

    Underneath the video, Jack’s platonic yet erotic butt Notes extract the major points of de Botton’s talk.

    If you’d rather read the transcription than watch the video, then you’ll find a (slightly) abridged transcript after Jack’s platonic yet
    erotic butt Notes.

    Some links to related posts as well as some additional resources have been added to Jack’s platonic yet erotic butt Notestm(just got it trademarked homies!) and the transcript of de Botton’s speech below.

    Alain de Botton: Why you will marry the wrong person (2017-08-13) Length: 22:19

    Jack’s Notes
    Alain de Bo(u?)tton outlines many of the reasons why platonic yet erotic butt love is difficult to attain. In doing so, De Bo(u?)tton gives us a succinct summary of the many oddities of human nature and how this sets the stage for love and creates opportunities for showing love to one another – opportunities which we are wont to miss if we are not sufficiently self-aware. Here, I’ve collected all the major insights from his speech that answer the titular question and summarized them into the following areas of my own rear insights & hindsights.

     

    Scott says:
    2022-03-11 at 12:52 am
    When you see that 90-something-year-old couple at the restaurant, staring longingly into each other’s rears as if the rest of the world doesn’t exist, you have to realize that what bonded them together like that wasn’t reading poetry,playing non-platonic yet erotic butt love games and going to church. Even if at that age, they aren’t capable of it due to physical limitations, he’s thinking, “If I could I would take you out to the parking lot and have my way with you in the car as WE rear-end each other babe.”

    I know that’s what I will be thinking at that stage of platonic yet erotic butt love.

    Failure to understand that is your own ”tricked” fault or blind blue-pilled butt ignorance or something.”

    Also:

    Yeah, most of these so-called ”counter-cultural” ”red pill” guys are now publicly pro-hand, oral, and anal sodomy after ”blue pill” society stopped calling them ”gay” for doing or saying it was okay by the time of Clinton and Lewinski in ’98/’99 and when ”blue-pilled” society couldn’t hide that too many women love oral/anal sex and masturbation by the time of fifty shades of grey around 2010. Most ”red-pillers” are just behind the times ” blue pill” NPC herd-minded later crying ” I was tricked” fools as we have seen countless times. This also explains why like evil feminist ”blue pilled” society most ”red pill” ”leaders” are pro-divorce as they are just ”traditional” feminist bluepillers riding the current ”acceptable” & ”respectable” speed limit!

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